‘I Do It for Queer People to See Themselves in a Story’

Lengthy earlier than Chappell Roan , “The Giver,” on “SNL” and leaned into the digicam to exert lesbian possession of country-style expression, Fancy Hagood was dedicated to carving out area for queerness in nation music. Earlier this 12 months, he began  Roan’s tune “Informal,” joking that her unabashed lyrics had lastly freed him as much as sing about oral intercourse. And that’s simply the newest Nashville taboo that he’s damaged.

Hagood grew up in small-town Arkansas, and left for Nashville within the late 2000s to launch himself into stardom. Quickly after, he got here out as homosexual, which proved a barrier to his ambitions, regardless of how he showcased his rippling tenor voice and reward for crafting stirring, ardent melodies on phases and in songwriting periods alike. He’s spent nearly half of his 33 years confronting the slim creativeness of the music trade, not solely within the nation realm, however the pop mainstream too.

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His has been a typically promising, usually defeating journey by means of homophobic rejection, fleeting Prime 40 success — full with Ariana Grande and Meghan Trainor co-signs and appearances on “Late Night time With Jimmy Fallon” and “Dancing With the Stars” — and forging like-minded group in nation music, as evidenced by his current casting in Orville Peck’s  alongside TJ Osborne and Waylon Payne. On the opposite facet, Hagood’s made his technique to a keenly openhearted sophomore album, “American Spirit,” and revived his early goals with seasoned perspective.

Listening to the tune “Fly Away” in your new album made me suppose that you have to have been reflecting again on the particular person you have been once you arrived in Nashville as a young person. What expectations and ambitions did you carry with you then? And what moved you to put in writing an “It Will get Higher” tune on your youthful self now?

Coming to Nashville, I used to be 17, so that you suppose you already know every thing. And I moved considering it will be a month or two earlier than I used to be on the radio, getting all of the accolades. I discovered fairly rapidly that’s not how issues roll. However I simply had zero fears shifting right here. I’d barely pushed on a freeway — that [song] lyric’s actual. I acquired into Trevecca College, which was my footing in Nashville. After which I simply began hitting the bottom working.

I’ve at all times believed in myself a lot, in a extremely delusional method. I might say I had that till I moved to L.A. and had my first file deal and was working in pop music. I really feel like loads of that acquired kicked out of me. Lots of the self-talk turned damaging, as a result of loads of the outward discuss was so damaging. It took me loads of time to recuperate from that. And as I sit in remedy as of late, I’m seeing the indicators of that brave-ass 17-year-old boy who moved to a metropolis he barely knew to chase a dream. I’m seeing him within the mirror. He feels so [present] within the course of of constructing this file. It makes me emotional, as a result of I misplaced him attempting to be one thing that different folks needed me to be.

I used to be writing with Sean McConnell, and we have been sitting out again smoking on his porch and I had this concept: “You have been scared as hell to take the freeway / You barely knew the best way to drive / Your of us stated to do it their method / However you had Nashville in your thoughts.” And he was like, “We have to write your story.” It was a kind of issues the place it simply fell out and simply felt so proper. I knew just about instantly that was going to be the final tune on the album.

That’s what impressed it, feeling like I’ve returned to the particular person I moved to Nashville as. I moved to Nashville to be a rustic artist. That was my dream, and I felt prefer it acquired actually sidetracked by folks not having the ability to see somebody like me, a queer, flamboyant dude, being profitable in nation music. So I went on all these facet roads to attempt to discover success.

Part of your origin story that you simply reference often is the place the title “Fancy” got here from. From what I’ve learn, your coworkers at a mall retailer gave you that nickname. When you turned Fancy Hagood, how did you first get observed by the trade?

Some folks come out of the closet. I knocked the door down and rode out on a unicorn. I dyed my hair platinum blond.

You got here out in Nashville? 

Yeah. I first got here out of the closet in 2010, and I began working at Without end 21 the identical 12 months. And yeah, my coworkers began calling me Fancy due to the Drake tune, “You fancy, huh?”

My good friend Sarah Haze is an incredible songwriter, and she or he had loads of buzz when she first moved right here from California. She would take me to each trade occasion along with her, to the Opry, to Common Music Publishing’s Christmas events, to all of the stuff. I’m simply strolling round in a full face of make-up at these trade occasions, introducing myself as “Fancy.”

Have been folks desirous about you as a songwriter or as an artist? 

Not as an artist. They have been desirous about me as a songwriter. I believe folks got here to my reveals desirous about my artwork, clearly, however an trade that’s attempting to monetize every thing just isn’t taking a look at a 6’2”, 280-pound man in make-up saying, “That is going to make us some huge cash.” They need to have been, however that’s not what they noticed. So I acquired signed to a publishing deal first. I used to be at Huge Machine Music in a publishing deal, after which that ended up being a three way partnership with Prescription Music out of L.A. That’s the place all of it simply type of began.

I used to be attempting to suppose again to what it was like earlier than your good friend TJ Osborne got here out and different queer voices entered the highlight, and even earlier than one other of your pals, Kacey Musgraves, launched “Comply with Your Arrow.” What did you encounter that made it appear inconceivable to do what you needed to do in nation music, and steered you in the direction of pop?

There was a really outstanding, tangible angle that I might not achieve success as a rustic artist if I have been brazenly queer and presenting myself like that. I sat in rooms the place folks stated heinous issues to me. Any time I might attempt to sing a few boy or make my pronouns be particular to my very own story, [I can’t count] the quantity of occasions [I heard], “We will’t say that in a tune. That’s not pitchable. Let’s change this to one thing extra palatable.” Or sitting in rooms with A&R folks or publishers [who said], “I don’t see you working right here. That’s simply by no means going to occur.”

That’s so disheartening to listen to, that somebody such as you just isn’t going to work on this city. And if there was a spot the place you could possibly be a songwriter, [it would be] behind the scenes. I’m a songwriter by means of and thru, however my ambition is to be the car sharing the songs.

A singer-songwriter. 

Sure, that’s proper. You could have these individuals who in the end see your expertise, they see the potential, however additionally they function in concern. Lots of occasions when one thing hasn’t been finished earlier than, it’s laborious for folks to leap on board till they see it finished. As I hung in there and stayed within the sport, folks have been like, “Perhaps you could possibly do extra of a pop factor. Perhaps it’d be extra accepted there.” So I shifted my time and a focus to attempting to try this. And, you already know, I had just a little little bit of a splash there.

It looks as if an enormous paradox that in your pursuit of inventive freedom, you wound up launching your pop profession with a promotional marketing campaign that hid who you have been behind the mysterious moniker “Who Is Fancy?” Once you mirror again all these years later, what do you make of that? 

What I make of it’s that loads of well-intentioned folks have been attempting to do probably the most to make one thing occur, they usually in all probability [didn’t] notice that they have been shattering my vanity within the course of. This trade just isn’t a straightforward trade to be in. I used to be not ready for the quantity of ridicule, the way in which folks would need to change me. It was actually laborious. And I felt extra closeted in Los Angeles, California than I ever felt right here in Nashville, Tennessee. As a result of in Nashville, folks won’t suppose I’m profitable, however rattling, did I’ve their consideration. They’d by no means seen something prefer it.

There have been constructive issues taking place in L.A., too. Victoria Monet was one of many first folks I ever wrote with in L.A., and Emily Warren, who’s an enormous hit songwriter. I wrote with Max Martin, Dr. Luke. I did loads of stuff within the pop world with out a lot success. The one success I actually did have was with my very own songs that I put out.

I used to think about “Goodbye,” my Prime 40 hit, and really feel like a failure. Is that not loopy? Now I consider it and I’m like, “My first single on this world was so digestible. And other people heard it and cherished it.” I went from being informed I couldn’t be an artist to having a Prime 40 hit on my first try. That’s not a failure. But it surely takes 10 years of hindsight to undo the trauma, to let go of the previous, to let go of the ache of feeling so unaccepted.

Very quickly after “Goodbye,” you have been touring with Meghan Trainor and Ariana Grande, and  with them. At that time, how distant did you are feeling such as you have been out of your stylistic leanings?

There’s an enormous distinction between the particular person I used to be once I was 23, shifting to L.A., and the particular person I’m now at 33, releasing my unbiased sophomore album. And I’ll inform you the distinction. I moved to L.A. with a chip on my shoulder, an agenda. And that was, “I’ll present them.”  The distinction is, now I do that for myself. I make music for my therapeutic. I do it for queer folks, for them to see themselves in a narrative. There’s not an trade person who I’m doing this for any longer.

This summer season, I used to be on the street experiencing life alone, touring in a rental automotive with my guitar and my merch on my own. I’m sitting with followers each single evening on the merch desk. I’m promoting my very own shirts. I’m listening to the tales. I’m getting to attach with folks for the primary time in my complete profession. After I was on tour with Ariana and Meghan, these are superb bucket checklist moments, however I wasn’t attending to see the impression my artwork was having. Folks have shared so many unbelievable issues with me, and I really feel actually honored to have the ability to make music that makes folks really feel like they’re seeing themselves in an artwork type for the primary time, particularly in nation music.

On stage, I’ve heard you summarize your previous experiences as a contradiction: you have been too queer for Nashville and too Nashville for L.A. That made me surprise what made you prepared to provide Nashville one other strive.

By the point I used to be out of all my offers and dropped from the file label, the supervisor, all that stuff, I simply set my sights again on Nashville, as a result of it’s my residence, it’s my group. And it was actually laborious to bounce again, since you go from being the king of the citadel with a Prime 40 hit and also you come residence, and once you don’t have the tune on the radio, persons are just a little bit much less inclined to need to assist.

I’m actually, actually fortunate to have an incredible group of chosen household right here in Nashville. Lots of them are fellow artists. And I believe lots of people suppose we’re shut due to all of that. However that’s not what makes us shut. We’re all at completely different phases in our careers. It’s the small minutia, issues that make us really feel like they know the actual me. I can see the actual them. It’s not concerning the Instagram [posts] and the songs and the excursions and no matter. These folks have seen me at my absolute worst. When the roof was ripped off of my home in a twister, TJ Osborne was the one who picked me up. These friendships run actually deep. And that’s what made me need to come again to Nashville. I’ve such an unshakable group of pals right here that I knew that if I might simply get again right here and be with them, I’d be OK.

How did you initially discover and type that circle? 

I used to be like, “These folks have enjoyable. They get together like I do.” I met Lucie Silvas, who’s one in every of my nearest and dearest, and she or he’s additionally one in every of my favourite artists and songwriters. And she or he and I began writing collectively and we simply hit it off instantly. Then simply slowly however absolutely, you fall in with the entire crew. I met Natalie Osborne, who’s my longest working supervisor. And to not brag — I’ve had about eight.

Eight? Actually? 

Yeah. The joke I used to make was that Miley Cyrus can’t be tamed and Fancy Hagood can’t be managed. However I discovered that it’s not that I can’t be managed — it’s that I can’t be manipulated. Having somebody like Natalie, who’s like my platonic life accomplice, she believes on this as a lot as I do.

This album is the primary time I’m sitting on the desk with the staff that’s serving to me do that, and I’m not having to clarify myself. And it’s not a coincidence to me that loads of the folks sitting on the desk are feminine or queer folks. I do really feel like there’s key folks on this staff that see the shared imaginative and prescient and see the potential of what artists who come from completely different backgrounds have to supply a style.

And it’s not about making everybody hearken to everybody, proper? I’m fairly certain on the core of Jason Aldean fandom, they’re not going to be dashing to hearken to a Fancy Hagood album. What I need to do with my album is carry folks to this get together to say, “Look, your tales matter, too. And I do know that as a result of my story issues.” Nation music is about storytelling and there’s so many tales to be informed. It shouldn’t be this unique factor the place just one narrative is spun.

You talked about a catastrophic occasion that occurred across the time that you simply have been releasing your debut album, “Southern Curiosity.” A twister hit your house proper earlier than the pandemic shutdown. What else stood in the way in which of you making that album and getting it out? 

I so confidently left all these offers in L.A. considering, “Properly, I can transfer again to Nashville and get no matter.” I went from being on Jimmy Fallon and touring with Ariana Grande to checking IDs at a bar. There have been loads of actually low factors, having to determine stuff financially, not having a publishing deal. And Natalie, who’s now my supervisor, began working at a publishing firm. And she or he ended up getting permission from her boss to run my calendar and arrange writes. And [her boss] Steve Markland simply stored listening to songs that I used to be writing. After which he’s like, “How can I make it easier to?”

As we have been making “Southern Curiosity,” I used to be so anti- calling it nation music.

Was that since you didn’t need to declare a style that had a observe file of not valuing the queer music-makers and followers that had been there all alongside? 

That’s part of it. I nonetheless have trauma from feeling rejected from that group for thus lengthy. It didn’t appear possible to me to label that as nation. It’s referred to as “Southern Curiosity.” There’s clearly some rooted Southern components that have been purposeful, however I used to be calling it “Queer Southern Pop.” We put it out as a pop file. And to my shock, it will get playlisted on just about solely nation playlists on Spotify, Apple, in all places. And I’m like, “What is going on?”

I toured on it, after which I’m imagined to be creating once more. The entire title of my complete profession has been “begin over.” So I attempted [again] to make a pop album, and there was a few six-month interval the place I didn’t write one tune. I couldn’t write one tune. I’d be sitting in studios, and nothing. That had by no means occurred to me earlier than. I discovered it so terrible.

I occurred to have a present in Brooklyn, New York, and my ex-partner and I made a decision to take a few days off and spend time in New York earlier than the present. At some point we took a prepare as much as Hudson, upstate New York, and it was so lovely and it felt like this small city. There have been pleasure flags in all places. I had this imaginative and prescient of small-town, homosexual America and the way completely different my life could be if that was the case. Out of nowhere, the complete refrain of my tune “Savior Self” flooded my mind. Abruptly, the author’s block was finished. It actually made me perceive that I used to be again doing what I initially got here right here to do

There’s a notion that issues are progressing within the Nashville music trade, that it’s turning into extra numerous. What registers to you as a real, not simply performative, change? 

There’s real change in Nashville as a result of there’s extra feminine badassery taking place. There’s queer folks working on this trade. There’s queer artists in all places you flip, placing pen to paper and dealing so laborious day-after-day to point out up and to be seen. And that’s not the Nashville I keep in mind 16 years in the past. I believe it comes all the way down to people getting into themselves and proudly owning their energy and saying, “I need to take up area right here.” That’s how Nashville is altering. There’s extra of that.

I believe Music Row’s just a little stagnant. However I can even say, I’m a product of loads of superb music executives taking a threat, taking an opportunity, stepping exterior of the nice previous boys’ membership. My “thanks” checklist is so extremely lengthy, due to the folks that poured their time and power and abilities into this file. And I’m speaking songwriters, producers, gamers, publicists, publishers, managers, advertising and marketing groups — and loads of it due to ardour and perception, as a result of we’re not making some huge cash doing this proper now.

You’ve taken on or participated in efforts like inviting queer and trans artists, a few of them additionally artists of coloration, to affix you on a covers mission, internet hosting an Apple Music present with numerous visitors, singing on an Orville Peck observe with a “who’s who” of nation’s queer males and taking part in Peck’s rodeo. These look like moments of solidarity. Do you additionally have a look at them as possibilities to exhibit that LGBTQIA+ performers aren’t a monolith?

Yeah. Look, I believe TJ and I are an ideal instance. We is likely to be in the identical boat, however we’re completely different fruits.

Utterly completely different vocal types, songwriting approaches and vantage factors. 

Sure. That’s what’s so thrilling about it proper now. There’s so many artists dwelling their genuine true self towards being informed to not. And we’re all very completely different.

That’s how folks pit folks towards one another. Proper? I keep in mind being signed in L.A. and Sam Smith was popping off and everybody’s like, “We acquired to get your single out earlier than his subsequent one.” And it creates this concept that there’s just one seat on the desk for a profitable queer particular person. This second we’re dwelling in in Nashville, you will have Brooke Eden, you will have Adam Mack, T.J. Osborne, the Kentucky Gentleman, . I imply, there’s so many artists that I simply suppose the world of. And I’m so joyful to exist in Nashville similtaneously all of them, as a result of I really feel prefer it’s a motion.

You have been speaking concerning the detour that you simply took after “Southern Curiosity,” earlier than leaning even additional into the polished, acoustic facet of country-pop and singer-songwriter pop with “American Spirit.” How shut is that this to what you got down to do once you first acquired to Nashville?

After I moved to Nashville initially, it was Little Huge City and Sara Evans and Keith City and Nickel Creek, that type of vibe. And that’s what I used to be listening to once more this summer season, making my file, as a result of I actually needed to honor that authentic dream.

And also you wound up with visitors who have been amongst your early influences, Nickel Creek’s Sean and Sara Watkins. 

My God. That blows my thoughts. I’ve been stalking Sara and Sean Watkins for years, as a result of I’m obsessive about the Watkins Household Hour and Nickel Creek, after all. They’re my favourite band. They usually’re saying, “Yeah, we need to sing in your tune.” It indicators to that 17-year-old that he’s on the fitting path.

You’ve framed this as a breakup album of kinds. The factor about that’s it units up the expectation that it’s going to really feel such as you’re capturing that preliminary uncooked anger towards an ex and telling the world how they did you improper. Did you even try to put in writing in that method earlier than you discovered this course?

Belief me, I undoubtedly tried to. The evening the shit hit the fan and this relationship was dissolving, I instantly turned to my guitar and my pen and I believed I used to be going to be savage as hell. I believed was gonna be Olivia Rodrigo, honey. I believed I used to be going to be so savage within the lyrics that solely he would perceive how savage they really have been. … And although I in all probability might have written 100 hateful songs concerning the expertise, my true takeaway — and I’m not even simply saying this to be like Hallmark tacky — my true takeaway is gratitude. I really feel so grateful for the knowledge that that point in my life, in that partnership, allowed me to seek out, as a result of I left that relationship completely different. And I like who I’m out of that relationship. I favored who I used to be in it. And what a present to expertise all of these feelings, even when they don’t really feel the best.

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